Intellivision Amico - Tommy Tallarico introduction + Q&A

Since the games are digital, here's something to consider that the "competition" is doing wrong: 

https://www.engadget.com/amp/2019/09/23/nintendo-switch-lite-game-sharing/

Tommy awhile ago i was going to ask you about vector type games on the Amico because i have always loved vector games and they never go out of style and always look great no matter how many years ago they were made...anyway i was watching the video at your with Smash GT and you mentioned you loved the Vectrex and joked you should buy the company lol..are there any plans for vector type games on the Amico other than the Asteroids that was in the demo? 

9 hours ago, IntelliMission said:

I have exciting news for you about the Amico.

 

The Amico will have limitations. Multiplayer is mandatory. 3D roaming is not allowed. Games with loads and loads of story and text, games that want to be movies, are not expected.

 

That was not the news. That's the cause, and the consequence is that... this console can have the same effect 80s and 90s consoles had in the minds of the developers. Limitations can encourage their imagination, just like it did in the old days. So this is my prediction: Several new genres will be created on this console.

Look, Tommy's right that system specs don't really matter if the games are good but please don't spit in my face and tell me it's raining. 

12 hours ago, Nolagamer said:

I remember when the original xbox came out I pre-ordered the console for halo.  My other two games would be dead or alive 4 and  max Payne.  Max was a great game but the big let down for me was that it was way to short for any amount of money for such a game.ibeat the game I under 6 hrs. I didn't try to do a speed run and had no Gane guide or cheat codes.just played it that morning but by evening I was done. I can say i.liked the game but felt like it needed something more to it.   

 

I do agree about many VR games being way to short. I'm afraid to spend money.on a game unless I'm sure it will be worth it for VR. Been burned too many times.  Hopefully after the next gen headsets come out we start to see a stronger push towards  full blown VR games.  

If you don't want to play a game again, maybe it's not such a great game.

10 hours ago, Blarneo said:

I thought you said 40. If it's 50 then awesome! 

I'm still not buying Math Fun. I do that crap for work.  😂

And I think Apple Arcade is the first with 50 launch titles... if you can call that a system. Service seems more appropriate.

I'm not going to commit to an exact number of games on launch at this point because like I mentioned in the past... if at the end it doesn't pass our quality control... then I'm not going to put it out.  So difficult to say exactly how many at this point.  30+ is a safe number.  50 is the dream. 

C'mon... doing that crap for work isn't an excuse!  I still played Guitar Hero!!!  

I don't consider Apple Arcade or the Google Play Pass a real home video game system/console.  Especially when it doesn't come with real controllers and you can't really play with family & friends in the same room. 
 

9 hours ago, Papy said:

Will the new Math Fun also teach tricks used for mental calculation?

 

For example, the way I would solve 33 x 26 mentally is :

 

(33 x 27) - 33

[(30+3) x (30-3)] - 33

[(30x30) - (3x3)] - 33

(900 - 9) - 33

891 - 33

(891 - 30) - 3

861 - 3

858

 

For those who never participated in mental calculation competitions, this may look complicated, but when we are used to it, we find the solution very quickly using this trick. When I was a kid, I would find the solution of something this easy in less than two seconds (and I just realized that 37 years later, I really need to practice!).

 

Amico's controller could really be helpful here. What I'm thinking is the Karma engine could use the screen on the controller of the weaker player to display a hint like (a+b) x (a-b) = a² - b² before the problem appears on the TV in order to give him an edge.

 

My god. Here I am, being excited about doing maths again. I think I really need to grow up.

So many great things to do when everyone has a screen on the controller with a main screen everyone can see!  So many of the haters have been underestimating this.  Just cause Nintendo screwed it up with the Wii U (and to some extent the Dreamcast before that)... doesn't mean that we are!  Most of the games are being designed around that fact!  Even stuff like Shark! Shark! and Frog Bog!  Can't wait to share more info!

7 hours ago, mr_me said:

If you don't want to play a game again, maybe it's not such a great game.

Well now, some games are story based so for SOME people, once they know the story, there's no incentive to replay it. It's the same with books and movies, I could see some movies multiple times (cinema is grand, although I have a decent home theatre system, I still love watching movies in the theatre with other people).  A lot of people do not watch movies a second time, or read books a second time. Doesn't mean the media they watched wasn't great.

Plus even great non-story games fall into this trap because of the amount of units we consume.  Nowadays, for good or ill, we move onto the next item up for bids because there really is a lot of media to go through.  For TV series, I still haven't watched Breaking Bad (*), Sopranos, Walking Dead and Game of Thrones at all because there is just so much I can watch right now, you know, cause of real life stuff.  We are overloaded with quality content.

* yeah one exception there.  I was channel surfing, caught it mid episode and I'm like "wow, this is pretty good stuff!".  Watched the next episode and about 1/3 of the way through, from its structure I suddenly said to myself "FML, this is the SERIES ENDER isn't it?!?".  Yep, it was...  🙄

8 hours ago, JeffVav said:

 

Totally share that pet peeve, which reminds me of another: logo screens you can't bypass. 

 

The only way I could feel good about clients forcing us to put in logo screens that couldn't be skipped is that's usually where we hid all the loading events, so no loading screens after that.

 

Still skippable logos would be nice.

I agree.  It depends on the game and how it's loaded.  Having our own in-house made Android/Linux based OS allows us to do some pretty fine tricks in that regards!  Some of our programmers are literally working on this THIS WEEK! 

8 hours ago, PlaysWithWolves said:

 

Look, Tommy's right that system specs don't really matter if the games are good but please don't spit in my face and tell me it's raining. 

I don't really agree. I am with IntelliMission that although limitations are seen as bad that situation can spark creativity to overcome the limitations. I would add the uniqueness of the controllers in there as a limitation too (I mean if you are used to an XBox style controller this is shock). It is is definitely going to be a challenge for developers and some are going to not do well with it. So this cuts both ways, but some may well invent or adapt game mechanics which are new and innovative, or new ways of story telling, explaining game mechanics, player interaction (because they are ALL couch coop games), etc. I mean you see this in VR games because the interface is so new. Some have amazing interfaces where they 'got it right' and some ruin good games with clunky control schemes. People are still innovating and learning (and failing - the other side of the coin) in that environment.

Just taking a look at the controller situation. Think of the Playdate, they added one new interface feature and most of the games are going to rely on the crank as a critical, unique play element. Also think of the Wii, motion controls were a game changer and introduced new kinds of game play. As did the Nintendo Zapper - people are still trying to bring back Duck Hunt in it's former glory with that unique input mechanism. Some people thrive on a challenge but most people shrink, those that thrive can do really interesting, new things.

8 hours ago, JeffVav said:

Since the games are digital, here's something to consider that the "competition" is doing wrong: 

 

https://www.engadget.com/amp/2019/09/23/nintendo-switch-lite-game-sharing/

It's like you guys here are reading our minds and going through our e-mails! 

This is one of the topics of our meetings today!  It's a very tough problem to navigate.  I feel Nintendo's pain on this because you want to be fair to everyone... but you open yourself up for the entire system and company being destroyed because of piracy.  HOWEVER!  Because of our built-in RFID and the fact that our controllers have their own dedicated CPU... we've fixed the problem and will show the industry how it should be done. 

8 hours ago, PlaysWithWolves said:

Look, Tommy's right that system specs don't really matter if the games are good but please don't spit in my face and tell me it's raining. 

I don't know if IntelliMission was sarcastic, but it doesn't change that limitations do have the secondary effect of encouraging innovation.

Imagine you're a developer. You want your next game to distinguish itself enough so people buy it. You have two solutions for that. The first one is to create a new kind of gameplay. The second solution is to copy an old successful game and to slap better graphics on it.

Creating good gameplay is really hard work. The result is the vast majority of developers instead choose the solution of creating better graphics as it is the easiest path.

In a scenario where the easiest path is not available because of limitations, developers have no choice but to distinguish their game from the competition using innovation.

8 hours ago, ASalvaro said:

Tommy awhile ago i was going to ask you about vector type games on the Amico because i have always loved vector games and they never go out of style and always look great no matter how many years ago they were made...anyway i was watching the video at your with Smash GT and you mentioned you loved the Vectrex and joked you should buy the company lol..are there any plans for vector type games on the Amico other than the Asteroids that was in the demo? 

I'm hoping so.  Star Wars (and Empire) were my favorite, Star Castle a close second... love me some Tempest and Battlezone as well.  And lets not forget Armor Attack!  That game gave me nightmares!  Lots of good stuff.  I love the way we're doing it with Asteroids... the ability to change between during certain times.  Something to explore for the others as well.  Would be amazing to see that with Tempest & Star Castle!

8 hours ago, PlaysWithWolves said:

 

Look, Tommy's right that system specs don't really matter if the games are good but please don't spit in my face and tell me it's raining. 

Not understanding the point you're trying to make.  Can you please expand on your thought?  Why do you feel anyone is exaggerating.  Generally curious to know your thoughts here.

Thanks.

24 minutes ago, Loafer said:

Well now, some games are story based so for SOME people, once they know the story, there's no incentive to replay it.

I'd say this is the case for most people. Of course, the real problem here is the gameplay is not that good in the first place, which is why the game relies on the story.

8 hours ago, mr_me said:

If you don't want to play a game again, maybe it's not such a great game.

This is how I felt about Red Dead II.  LOVED the first one and although the 2nd one is so much more.  I didn't have as much fun, thought the controls were even more complex and frustrating, disliked the fact that I felt I needed to do everything the game wanted me to (in order to proceed) and after only 5 or 6 hours... I put it down and never played it again.

I struggled with this for awhile... but then simply decided... the game may have been BIGGER and more expensive... but for me... it didn't have the fun factor the first one did therefore in my eyes... it was a far less superior game IMHO.   I played the first one easily over 100 hours.  The 2nd one... 5 or 6. 

 

2 minutes ago, Papy said:

I'd say this is the case for most people. Of course, the real problem here is the gameplay is not that good in the first place, which is why the game relies on the story.

It's the opposite for Metal Gear games. 

30 minutes ago, GrudgeQ said:

I don't really agree. I am with IntelliMission that although limitations are seen as bad that situation can spark creativity to overcome the limitations. I would add the uniqueness of the controllers in there as a limitation too (I mean if you are used to an XBox style controller this is shock). It is is definitely going to be a challenge for developers and some are going to not do well with it. So this cuts both ways, but some may well invent or adapt game mechanics which are new and innovative, or new ways of story telling, explaining game mechanics, player interaction (because they are ALL couch coop games), etc. I mean you see this in VR games because the interface is so new. Some have amazing interfaces where they 'got it right' and some ruin good games with clunky control schemes. People are still innovating and learning (and failing - the other side of the coin) in that environment.

 

Just taking a look at the controller situation. Think of the Playdate, they added one new interface feature and most of the games are going to rely on the crank as a critical, unique play element. Also think of the Wii, motion controls were a game changer and introduced new kinds of game play. As did the Nintendo Zapper - people are still trying to bring back Duck Hunt in it's former glory with that unique input mechanism. Some people thrive on a challenge but most people shrink, those that thrive can do really interesting, new things.

You are correct.  We're already seeing this happen.  So many creative and new design elements coming from the fact of how our controller and system is designed.  Going to surprise a lot of people!

12 minutes ago, Papy said:

I don't know if IntelliMission was sarcastic, but it doesn't change that limitations do have the secondary effect of encouraging innovation.

 

Imagine you're a developer. You want your next game to distinguish itself enough so people buy it. You have two solutions for that. The first one is to create a new kind of gameplay. The second solution is to copy an old successful game and to slap better graphics on it.

 

Creating good gameplay is really hard work. The result is the vast majority of developers instead choose the solution of creating better graphics as it is the easiest path.

 

In a scenario where the easiest path is not available because of limitations, developers have no choice but to distinguish their game from the competition using innovation.

Nailed it 100%!!!  Exactly what we're seeing... and like I mentioned... the developers LOVE IT!  They would much rather be pushed on creative design over trying to compete with the latest shader and best way to do a realistic real time blood spat.  This has been the best part of having Indie studios over the past 10 years.  They don't have EA/Activsion/Ubi money... so they need to INVENT as opposed to copying others. 

This is how we used to make games in the old days.  It wasn't that we didn't have the budgets of EA, etc. it's that we didn't have the technology for graphics, audio, etc.! 

4 minutes ago, Tommy Tallarico said:

This is how I felt about Red Dead II.  LOVED the first one and although the 2nd one is so much more.  I didn't have as much fun, thought the controls were even more complex and frustrating, disliked the fact that I felt I needed to do everything the game wanted me to (in order to proceed) and after only 5 or 6 hours... I put it down and never played it again.

I struggled with this for awhile... but then simply decided... the game may have been BIGGER and more expensive... but for me... it didn't have the fun factor the first one did therefore in my eyes... it was a far less superior game IMHO.   I played the first one easily over 100 hours.  The 2nd one... 5 or 6. 

 

Hmmm, I got only a couple of hours in RDR2 as well.  I loved every second of that couple of hours but in the past couple of years, this has come up a few times where I start a game and don't finish it.  The lone exception was Last of us when I played it on PS4, man I played that in one weekend, haven't done that for other games in a long time.   The older I get, the less I do well with most games that have repetitive tasks as part of it's "RPG" factor and RDR2 falls into that.  The story seems great but so much to do between the story bits that I dunno, can't seem to motivate myself to go through it.

Then again, my youngest says I suffer from OFS (Old Fart Syndrome) where I find as I get older, maybe my attention span is shrinking.  I dunno Tommy, maybe you are afflicted by that too? 

On the flip side, that falls perfectly into retro gaming and one of your commandments for Amico:  You can figure out what to do and how to do it within 15 seconds of playing. Perfect for us OFS's members sir!

6 minutes ago, Tommy Tallarico said:

This is how we used to make games in the old days.  It wasn't that we didn't have the budgets of EA, etc. it's that we didn't have the technology for graphics, audio, etc.! 

… and in such a small size too.  How the old devs managed to fit complete games inside of what constitutes two typed up pages in MSWord is beyond me.  Well I know how they did it but it still boggles the mind

20 minutes ago, Tommy Tallarico said:

This is how I felt about Red Dead II.  LOVED the first one and although the 2nd one is so much more.  I didn't have as much fun, thought the controls were even more complex and frustrating, disliked the fact that I felt I needed to do everything the game wanted me to (in order to proceed) and after only 5 or 6 hours... I put it down and never played it again.

I struggled with this for awhile... but then simply decided... the game may have been BIGGER and more expensive... but for me... it didn't have the fun factor the first one did therefore in my eyes... it was a far less superior game IMHO.   I played the first one easily over 100 hours.  The 2nd one... 5 or 6. 

 

Actually I loved max Payne I just hated that it was extremely short.i did rebuy as a budget PC title and played mods for it as well as multiplayer mods. The game needed something more to it but the short experience I had was enjoyable no real regrets , just i felt shorted big time.  Not every game needs 100 plus hours but some games can have and be great and keep you wanting more.    I loved red dead I have yet to.play red dead 2 yet.  Know if we ever get a larger Game even in 2.5 d form with 3d cut scenes. An.la noir type game in both single and multiplayer form could be extremely fun on amico.  And even a max Payne style game.

Tommy I got the perfect license choice for you guys to do exactly that with while being able to stay e10plus.  Dick Tracy

18 minutes ago, GrudgeQ said:

I don't really agree. I am with IntelliMission that although limitations are seen as bad that situation can spark creativity to overcome the limitations. I would add the uniqueness of the controllers in there as a limitation too (I mean if you are used to an XBox style controller this is shock). It is is definitely going to be a challenge for developers and some are going to not do well with it. So this cuts both ways, but some may well invent or adapt game mechanics which are new and innovative, or new ways of story telling, explaining game mechanics, player interaction (because they are ALL couch coop games), etc. I mean you see this in VR games because the interface is so new. Some have amazing interfaces where they 'got it right' and some ruin good games with clunky control schemes. People are still innovating and learning (and failing - the other side of the coin) in that environment.

 

Just taking a look at the controller situation. Think of the Playdate, they added one new interface feature and most of the games are going to rely on the crank as a critical play element. Also think of the Wii, motion controls were a game changer and introduced new kinds of game play. As did the Nintendo Zapper - people are still trying to bring back Duck Hunt in it's former glory with that unique input mechanism. Some people thrive on a challenge but most people shrink, those that thrive can do really interesting, new things.

If the controllers are limitations then they should re-think the controllers.  But I'm pretty sure Tommy doesn't see them as limitations.

Yes, I acknowledge constraints can inspire creativity.  You both have written "can" and not "will" because, I'd suggest, even subconsciously you know freedom inspires more creativity.

2 minutes ago, Tommy Tallarico said:

Not understanding the point you're trying to make.  Can you please expand on your thought?  Why do you feel anyone is exaggerating.  Generally curious to know your thoughts here.

As I wrote above, limitations can cause creativity but to say that it's exciting and will lead to new genres seems a bit of a stretch.  That's not to say your couch co-op ideas combined with whatever innovations your controllers may bring won't bring on new games. But I believe if you thought the controllers were a limitations, they wouldn't be there.  I suspect they are enhancements to your console.

Do the commandments count as limitations? I guess, but they don't seem all that limiting considering the hardware and target audience.

I just don't see what's exciting about limitations.  Perhaps parents would be excited for 100% family-friendly content, sure.  But, the post came off a little overenthusiastic and perhaps desperate-sounding.  Like a car salesman saying, "This Yugo is under-powered and doesn't have a radio, power steering or comfortable suspension, but it's exciting you'll get creative with music and build up your forearms!"

In fact, I'm a bit surprised you even want to talk about limitations at all when the console is sounds very capable of doing the types of games you've envisioned on the system.  I don't see that as a bug, but a feature.  

If anyone here has not played and finished The Secret of Monkey Island, go play it NOW (the original! This game must be played in pixelated 2D without voices. Avoid the remakes).

It is a perfect and rare example of how a game can be build around the story. Ron Gilbert said that the puzzles were designed so that the player could progress in the story, not to get the player stuck. The puzzles were created after the story, and the graphics was the last thing that they added.

But the good thing is that, being a good story with some great humor, it still feels like a game. I hate voices in graphic adventure games. This game doesn't try to be a movie. It is my favorite game of all time, also because graphic adventures are very easy to program technically but very hard when it comes to puzzle design.

Secret of Monkey Island (tm) is my favorite graphic adventure game too.  I know these types of games probably don't fall into Amico territory because it's kind of single player experiences however I find these types of games are fun multiplayer games. Although my wife doesn't game at all anymore, back in the late 80's/early 90's, she played some of the Sierra games with me on the Amiga.  So in essence, there was almost like a "party" game because of the puzzle aspect.

The game was so innovative in how it approached the adventure tropes of its day and well, it was just so funny and you are right IM, the difficulty balance was PERFECT!  The sequel was awesome too.  I hope at some point, someone finds a way to make such humorous games again on modern platforms like the Amico.  It's a genre that is sadly forgotten and missed.

Well, I guess the only way to make these games for the Amico would be to create some kind of additional multiplayer mode, perhaps some co-op alternative "missions". Of course, the controls would have to be adapted and probably pixel hunting removed, but that's probably a good thing after all.