Intellivision Amico - Tommy Tallarico introduction + Q&A

Nintendo would own their Popeye video game but the Popeye characters might be public domain.

Has nintendo licensed their stuff to other video game companies since the 1980s?

Edit:

I never cared much for nintendo's Popeye, still like their Donkey Kong, DKjr not so much.  I also liked their arcade Punch-Out.

2 hours ago, Tommy Tallarico said:

Yo!  I definitely think at some point we'll do a remake of Thunder Castle!  Not in the pipeline yet, but definitely on our "to do" list.  Haven't really thought that much about wrestling... but a good idea that I'll to our list as I know how HUGELY popular it is. 

Thanks!

 

 

Hey tommy I think you should look into the nwa ( national wrestling alliance) billy corgan took them.over 2 years ago and has been re branding them and buding them back from just being a relic  of the past as a name on the indy scene    back to prominents.  They recently launched a weekly program on youtube which has been buding steam for them.  I dobt know if you are or ever was a wrestling fan... but it's a old school  yet modern take on studio wrestling , which is how the territories  around the country operated from 60s to 80s .  The set is a retro modem take on the old  Georgia world championship wrestling set of the 70s 80s on Tbs.  

Being a musician  I'm sure working with corgan in anyway might be a cool team up. 

They have licences themselves to retromania wrestling which is a cool looking game ,  that's the official sequel to wwf wrestlefest(arcade) and matmania as they got the license from technos. They are using the nwa world title in a championship mode. As well as a bunch of other wrestling promotions.. but it's not an exclusive. 

I think an nwa game especially  the nwa power show fits with amico  especially game design wise on amico as you won't need a giant crowed and could gave a cool intimate  small crowed that you can interact with in game....another great troupe  of the studio wrestling format.

Heres ep 1 out of 13.  Plus it would be awesome to see two great brands that  like intellivision  and nwa  making a great comeback together.  And as a brand the nwa itself as the national wrestling alliance goes back to 1948 prior it was the national wrestling association  from like 1905  so people from many ages will have a connection  much like many amico experiences.  And much like amico the nwa are honoring  the past when building  towards the  future.

Ah, Popeye was a good game.

I didn't play it much in the Arcade.  But had it for some consoles over the years.

I like the re-imagined concept, but would always want a faithful version included.  

Games that got my quarters BITD...  I also didn't have Money to play often....  But if I had a quarter, I would go to the corner store to play!

Lunar Lander.  Yeah, I am old!

Donkey Kong

Galaga

Pac Man  ( have a hard time starting a game of this now! )

QBert

Track and Field

Gravitar

Monaco GP  ( the hardware one. Not available in rom   )   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monaco_GP_(video_game)

Games I discovered later...  Qix, Ping Pong, Outrun, Pole Position I + II etc.   Anyone up for a ride to Fun spot!   https://www.funspotnh.com/-Articles/pc-hedgehogs.htm

Any of these on the Amico would get some love!

44 minutes ago, jaybird3rd said:

The bumbling company currently masquerading as Atari crowdfunded "that Ataribox?", thereby offloading all the risk onto their backers, because they did not—and, arguably, still do not—have the talent or resources to release it on their own.  Intellivision Entertainment is accepting preorders for a "Founder's Edition" Amico console, a project that they already initiated and secured funding for and were already on track to develop and release, without resorting to crowdfunding.  As far as I can tell, the only thing that the two have in common is the superficial resemblance of paying money up front to support a product that is not yet available, so to conflate them seems to me to be a serious stretch.

 

After having been here through the RetroVGS and Chameleon trainwrecks, and having followed the VCS since it was known as "that Ataribox?", I think I'm alert as anyone to the dangers of "asking for money based on assured success and guaranteed refunds."  I don't see the Amico as belonging to the same category at all, and I'm surprised that so many people seem to be having so much trouble distinguishing the difference.

From my perspective, the issue is that Tommy was pretty clear here and elsewhere that this wasn't another crowdfunded project and that financing had been secured.  While I have said repeatedly that Tommy has shown far more than either of those projects, it appears that he is still ready to accept preorders of a substantial amount of money (yes, $100 is still a good chunk when other companies have accepted preorders with nothing down or $25 at most) without having final hardware, pricing or other details nailed down.  I just don't see how that is a reasonable approach.  It's not about distinguishing the difference between Amico and two scammy projects, it's about the fact that Amico is now adopting one of the things the two scammy projects did after repeatedly saying Amico wouldn't go down that road.  

1 minute ago, bojay1997 said:

From my perspective, the issue is that Tommy was pretty clear here and elsewhere that this wasn't another crowdfunded project and that financing had been secured.  While I have said repeatedly that Tommy has shown far more than either of those projects, it appears that he is still ready to accept preorders of a substantial amount of money (yes, $100 is still a good chunk when other companies have accepted preorders with nothing down or $25 at most) without having final hardware, pricing or other details nailed down.  I just don't see how that is a reasonable approach.  It's not about distinguishing the difference between Amico and two scammy projects, it's about the fact that Amico is now adopting one of the things the two scammy projects did after repeatedly saying Amico wouldn't go down that road. 

So, you are disappointed and you are not a buyer. Understood.

Thank you.

2 hours ago, Tommy Tallarico said:

I always like to give the comparison of the Wii.  The Wii sold 102 milliion units.  The Switch... only half of that (granted it still has a few years left in the life cycle... but it is NOT going to do the numbers the Wii did.  So where are those other 50 million people who bought the Wii and not the Switch so far?  Those 50 million people who paid $250 ($320 in today's money) to play Wii Bowling and never bought another game?   Is the answer they all went to mobile?  Okay... then that means they've done nothing but play all by themselves with their face buried in their screens when they have proven in the past that they will pay $250 just to do simple digital bowling with friends.

I like our chances.   

 

Oooh, those are fighting words!  *kidding.  Kinda*

I think you might be undervisualizing (Spell-check, that's a word if I say it is) the Switch market reach still outstanding.  The Wii sold unbelievably well, it had its base Nintendo audience (some 24-30 million if looking at GameCube and N64 carry-over), and ~70 million casuals or [other systems' gaming audience] curious to check it out.  Its audience, as we know from the "Bought Wii Sports and I'm All Set" numbers, largely weren't in it for traditional gaming.  Motion control was THE thing.  I love the Wii, its library has some great games, but I think it benefited far and away from its casual audience, and unfortunately most of its game offereing FOR that audience was of questionable quality.  Too much cheap shovelware cash-ins left people with a "Yeah, that was fun, this is not, moving on" taste in their mouths.  Its better games though, that didn't sell in the millions but were well-made, non-shovelware?  Soooo much fun to be had there. 

But the Switch has more room to grow than that Wii market.  Maybe too much emphasis on that 1:1 audience conversion..  Most of those 50 million outstanding Wii owners who bought a Wii and haven't returned to the Nintendo well for a Switch.. they're not being sold a product they want.  They're not making the switch.  ::buh-dum, Dum!::  Thank you, thank you.  *audience groans*   But the Switch is picking up audiences the Wii never had.  DS owners (154m) and 3DS owners (76m+) who had a portable "Nintendo" experience.. a good portion of that audience will see strong echoes of DS-style gaming on the Switch and adopt (likely most are part of the Switch's 46-50m current install base, will continue to bleed over as price drops or the discounts they've been waiting for don't materialize and they buy).  Do we know the number of PlayStation or Xbox owners or primary PC/Steam gamers who are buying a Switch as their second system?  This probably was a small number for the Wii - there wasn't much "gamer" appeal.  But the Switch is consistently putting out more traditional deep-dive gaming experiences, making these their centerpiece every month or two alongside traditional Nintendo IPs.  Skyrim, Witcher 3, Wolfenstein, Cuphead, LA Noire, Astral Chain, No More Heroes, Mortal Kombat, Resident Evil, Doom, Dark Souls, Darksiders, Diablo, Darkest Dungeon, Dead Cells, Daemon X Machina, Dragon's Dogma (Jeez are there a lot of hardcore games starting with a D, is there a publisher sweet spot for such games??).. it's doing a much better job at presenting itself as a machine capable of core gamer experiences.  Better by ANY measure than the Wii or Wii U did.   Let's not forget, PlayStation Portable sold about 82 million units.  Sony hasn't indicated any interest in a portable system.. that's an audience that wasn't core to the Wii but the Switch could be gaining traction with.  And it's brandishing its reputation as an Indie darling machine (the PS Vita had that for a minute).  I think some amount of Vita and Sony owners, PC/Steam gamers see these titles and are willing to buy a Switch.  

Other Switch audiences that Wii didn't have much of a footprint with, much smaller right now, but still of note: Adults who aren't current gamers but do travel, or see the portability of the Switch and think it fits their lifestyle (a market Amico is going after).. as a new father, I was so appreciative of the portability of my 3DS when up late at night with our daughters.  Couldn't spend three hours gaming, but 40 minutes as she drifted to sleep was a welcome little bliss.  I see the Switch appeal there and see that in their marketing, especially to adults who travel (the 3DS and DS wasn't really focusing on traveling adults - the Switch though...).  That's a sizeable market that wasn't buying a Wii for those reasons.  Europe is a bigger deal this generation than they were in the Wii days.  Europeans have been PlayStation and PC market for a couple decades now.  But the Switch presence is significantly higher than any recent Nintendo product.  If Europeans are becoming Switch users, that's a big market that didn't care about the Wii U or GameCube or N64, and only made a smallish splash for the Wii.   Then there's China (and emerging markets).  Notoriously frowned upon home consoles, mobile gaming in China alone is bigger than anything anywhere else.  Nintendo's making hard choices with Tencent to distribute there, but their two initial pre-orders sold out in minutes.  Finally, I think Switch is making an appeal to retro gamers with soooo many 8-bit and 16-bit stylized graphics.  I know Amico isn't looking for that aesthetic per se (its retro revival approach is in the classic games re-imagined and incorporated - which I'm all for), but there's that audience.  Xbox has little to offer, Sony has some but it isn't their strong suit.  Switch has the Nintendo back catalog (utilized well on the Wii's Virtual Console), and a bookshelf worth of titles all flaunting their pixelated throwback aesthetic.  That's an audience the Wii tapped into a little as it was emerging, but the Switch has a much stronger play for.  Oh and the Wii's peak was 10, 11 years ago.. there's just more market out there.  Atari's colossal marketshare with 20 million units in the early 80s or Nintendo's 90% share with 45+ million units by early 90s seem quite quaint looking at the video game market today.

All to say, I like Amico's chances; but I can also see Nintendo reaching Wii numbers/~100m in another three years.  DS/3DS audiences, hardcore crossover, indie supporters, retro enthusiasts, part of PSP/Vita's audience, better performance in Europe, emergence of the Chinese market and increasing marketshare in MENA, South Asia.. I'll take that bet 🙂  

3 hours ago, Tommy Tallarico said:

Yes.  It's true... you do not see the rationale behind it.  That's fine.  I respect that.  The Founder's Editions is CLEARLY not for you.  And again... that's fine.  You've said numerous times that you wish the project well and I appreciate that.

But disagreeing or throwing caution to the wind for folks who disagree with your personal opinion on the matter really isn't going anywhere.  I mean what is your ultimate goal with all this?  To get others not to spend their money the way they want?  For them to not be excited and want to support something they love?

I'm being serious.  Please reflect on why there is so much back and forth on this and what your ultimate goal is for continuing to bring it up.  I totally get that it's not for you.  I'm just puzzled as to why people are kinda fighting about this.  You either like the idea and want in... or you don't like the idea and will wait to see more.  Seems pretty cut and dry to me.  Am I missing something?  Maybe you are just concerned how others will look at the project now and you don't want there to be anything bad?  That's cool.  That's commendable... but again... go look on Facebook & Twitter (or maybe I should start sharing the thousands of e-mails we get) saying that this is something they want and is super cool for us to be doing it.  This is what I don't understand.  The huge majority of folks like the idea... but some are saying it's bad or groups us in with other bad crap.  The overwhelming majority disagrees with you.  And trust me... if it was the other way around... then I wouldn't do it!  No matter what the investors or retailers wanted.  I'd see that it's an awful idea and I wouldn't want the majority to be pissed about it.

 

 

My ultimate goal is the same as most of the people who have been on this forum for years, to discuss classic video games and related interests with other like-minded people.  You represented that this was a thread to ask some questions and have some discussion about the Amico.  That's what I have been doing.  

While I appreciate that you may not believe the Amico is for me, the reality is that I am one of those people who is actually most likely to buy something like this.  I'm an early adopter, I have kids and nephews, I spend a lot of time with other parents, some of whom are board and video gamers and I love classic video games. 

As for my intentions in bringing up my concerns about this preorder plan, yes, in part it is to prevent anyone from losing money they don't have, but also because I believe it's feedback you should have as I am also someone who interacts on other forums and websites outside of the relatively tiny echochamber of Atari Age and your Twitter and Facebook pages.  Indeed, you asked for "help and feedback" in your January 6th tweet.  In looking at that tweet, it appears there were only 59 replies, 33 retweets and 160 likes.  Not exactly a mass avalanche of responses or reactions.  Similarly, Facebook had 285 comments (not all of which were unqualified support), 575 likes and 44 reshares.  Better, but still a really, really small sample size for a product that is intended to sell millions.        

As always, it's your company and your product, but doing things that divide your audience or declaring that some people aren't the right people for your product just seems like an unproductive approach.  Rather than spending time engaging in arguments and debates with people you don't agree with or attacking influencers or other companies that are well established in the marketplace, I would hope your focus would be on sharing information and making a great product.  I think it's perfectly acceptable for you to declare that we will just have to agree to disagree as you have done several times, but following that up with an argument or attack just seems to defeat the entire purpose of that phrase.     

52 minutes ago, bojay1997 said:

While I have said repeatedly that Tommy has shown far more than either of those projects, it appears that he is still ready to accept preorders of a substantial amount of money (yes, $100 is still a good chunk when other companies have accepted preorders with nothing down or $25 at most) without having final hardware, pricing or other details nailed down.

Define "nailed down."  The RetroVGS and "that Ataribox?" went to crowdfunding before any hardware design whatsoever had been done (as evidenced by the ludicrous John Carlsen "kitchen table lab" video); their approach was to get other peoples' money first, and then figure out what to design—and, in the case of "that Ataribox?", redesign multiple times—later.  Intellivision Entertainment has kept the Amico hardware specs close to the vest, and as I've said before, they've been wise to do so ... but that's hardly the same thing as claiming that the hardware isn't "nailed down."  They clearly have enough of a working prototype to begin building the games; to get to that point, the most important design decisions have already been locked in, and they're past the point where they should have to make any show-stopping changes.  There's no good reason they should have to wait for the final production hardware to offer a special edition as a preorder.

As for the price ... if you're not comfortable paying that much for a "Founder's Edition" preorder, there's no obligation to do so; it's clearly not for you, so just wait for the regular Amico to come out.  The difference between the Amico and "that Ataribox?" in this regard is that, if everyone holds on to their money until after it's released, "that Ataribox?" (and other similarly crowdfunded consoles) won't be released at all, while the Amico will be released regardless.

52 minutes ago, bojay1997 said:

It's not about distinguishing the difference between Amico and two scammy projects, it's about the fact that Amico is now adopting one of the things the two scammy projects did after repeatedly saying Amico wouldn't go down that road.  

What do you mean by "one of the same things"?  Is it the idea of accepting money up front for something that hasn't been released yet?  Just about every preorder offered by everybody would fall into that category.

32 minutes ago, bojay1997 said:

As always, it's your company and your product, but doing things that divide your audience or declaring that some people aren't the right people for your product just seems like an unproductive approach.  Rather than spending time engaging in arguments and debates with people you don't agree with or attacking influencers or other companies that are well established in the marketplace, I would hope your focus would be on sharing information and making a great product.  I think it's perfectly acceptable for you to declare that we will just have to agree to disagree as you have done several times, but following that up with an argument or attack just seems to defeat the entire purpose of that phrase.

I'm not aware that anyone has ever said that "some people aren't the right people for your product"; they've said that the (totally optional) "Founder's Edition" isn't a product intended for every customer, which is very different.  I also wouldn't consider responding to unfair criticisms and inaccurate reporting as "attacking."  As for sharing information and listening to feedback, that's what this thread is supposed to be all about.  If there is any "division" in the audience, it's because some seem to persist in drawing analogies between things and situations which are almost completely different.

10 minutes ago, jaybird3rd said:

Define "nailed down."  The RetroVGS and "that Ataribox?" went to crowdfunding before any hardware design whatsoever had been done (as evidenced by the ludicrous John Carlsen "kitchen table lab" video); their approach was to get other peoples' money first, and then figure out what to design—and, in the case of "that Ataribox?", redesign multiple times—later.  Intellivision Entertainment has kept the Amico hardware specs close to the vest, and as I've said before, they've been wise to do so ... but that's hardly the same thing as claiming that the hardware isn't "nailed down."  They clearly have enough of a working prototype to begin building the games, and to get to that point, the most important design decisions have already been locked in.  There's no good reason they should have to wait for the final production hardware to offer a special version of it as a preorder.

 

As for the price ... if you're not comfortable paying that much for a special edition preorder, there's no obligation to do so; just wait for the regular Amico to come out.  The difference between the Amico and "that Ataribox?" in this regard is that, if everyone holds on to their money until after it's released, "that Ataribox?" (and other similarly crowdfunded consoles) won't be released at all, while the Amico will be released regardless.

 

What do you mean by "one of the same things"?  Is it accepting money up front for something that hasn't been released yet?  Just about every preorder offered by everybody would fall into that category.

Considering g the vcs has like 2.5 months til release and still in pre production and no games announced  nor have crowedfunders got a system yet for early access.    The amico is  practically  finalized doing mostly testing and probably a few tweaks.  Dev's are making games and they are already working on getting more.    And production I think is aimed for march or april. 

Nothing wrong doing a pre order on a special edition  it's only a tiny part of the current audience that will get one.  But come spring you can go to gamestop walmart and various other stores and do a traditional pre order. 

Nothing wrong with selling a special one early . It's not aimed for the average buyer.  

17 minutes ago, bojay1997 said:

From my perspective, the issue is that Tommy was pretty clear here and elsewhere that this wasn't another crowdfunded project and that financing had been secured.  While I have said repeatedly that Tommy has shown far more than either of those projects, it appears that he is still ready to accept preorders of a substantial amount of money (yes, $100 is still a good chunk when other companies have accepted preorders with nothing down or $25 at most) without having final hardware, pricing or other details nailed down.  I just don't see how that is a reasonable approach.  It's not about distinguishing the difference between Amico and two scammy projects, it's about the fact that Amico is now adopting one of the things the two scammy projects did after repeatedly saying Amico wouldn't go down that road.  

I get the point.  But details don't get nailed down until right up until the 11th hour, just before go ahead on production.  Sometimes post-production, leading to costly fixes.  Sometimes they're wrong and get adjusted after release.  You'll note Sony and Xbox have also been mum on price.  Nintendo wasn't saying anything about Switch Lite's price until it was already shipped.  There's no *perfect* time to announce a pre-order - from our perspective as consumers, perhaps a little later would've made critics happier as the production was already happening, once we have Walmart locked in at a price.  But on the flip side, Intellivision has a great deal to benefit from doing so now as Tommy pointed out.  The amount in their view isn't keeping anything afloat, it's trivial in and of itself, but significant for what it can say to buyers and as chum for the fanbase.  All twelve of us 

"Substantial amount of money" is subjective.  The old guy promising to send me pictures of a starving kid in Africa assured me that even 2 cents a day was a significant amount of money.  If it were a $10 down payment, that's significant to somebody living paycheck to paycheck and accumulating late penalties every month.  All subjective.  And in this case, if we're now looking at $260,000 of a $200 million + project (manufacturing, hardware and software dev figures, marketing and operational costs 2018-2021, concluding 1 year of market make-or-break, it is one-tenth of one percent of real budgets in play.  That's something we could not see with the two crowd-funded projects (VCS, Chameleon) referenced here.  It's no more crowd-funded than your building maintenance guy is you-funded by your $100 holiday bonus.  It ignores the big picture, ignores the body of work to pick apart something because a facet of its appearance doesn't sit well for you.   

8 minutes ago, Nolagamer said:

Considering g the vcs has like 2.5 months til release and still in pre production and no games announced  nor have crowedfunders got a system yet for early access.    The amico is  practically  finalized doing mostly testing and probably a few tweaks.  Dev's are making games and they are already working on getting more.    And production I think is aimed for march or april. 

 

Nothing wrong doing a pre order on a special edition  it's only a tiny part of the current audience that will get one.  But come spring you can go to gamestop walmart and various other stores and do a traditional pre order. 

 

Nothing wrong with selling a special one early . It's not aimed for the average buyer.  

Not true.  Atari showed off Asteroid.  That's a game I think.  I know, I know, "Asteroids was amazing" you say.  Asteroid though?  A singular hunk of rock hurling down at us?  Gonna be Aaaaammmmaaaaazing!!! (you gotta just sing it, trust me).  Plus I heard you get to shoot Bruce Willises (Willisi?  Willoose?  What's the plural of Willis?) at the rock.  Yippee kay-yay. 

Oh and they've got Yar's Revenge.  Not Yars' Revenge - Yars, as we all know, was a contractual holdout.  Stay strong my man.  Not Y'all's Revenge, which as a NYer I find grating, shoulda went with Youse Guys' Revenge, but I digress picking on their inability to spell the names of 2 of the 7 games they showcased.  Anyway they have a couple classics, Tempest 4000 (available elsewhere) and the soon-to-be-available elsewhere Antstream.  They gots the games.  But it may just deflate any funders hopes and dreams. 

15 minutes ago, bojay1997 said:

My ultimate goal is the same as most of the people who have been on this forum for years, to discuss classic video games and related interests with other like-minded people.  You represented that this was a thread to ask some questions and have some discussion about the Amico.  That's what I have been doing.  

 

While I appreciate that you may not believe the Amico is for me, the reality is that I am one of those people who is actually most likely to buy something like this.  I'm an early adopter, I have kids and nephews, I spend a lot of time with other parents, some of whom are board and video gamers and I love classic video games. 

 

As for my intentions in bringing up my concerns about this preorder plan, yes, in part it is to prevent anyone from losing money they don't have, but also because I believe it's feedback you should have as I am also someone who interacts on other forums and websites outside of the relatively tiny echochamber of Atari Age and your Twitter and Facebook pages.  Indeed, you asked for "help and feedback" in your January 6th tweet.  In looking at that tweet, it appears there were only 59 replies, 33 retweets and 160 likes.  Not exactly a mass avalanche of responses or reactions.  Similarly, Facebook had 285 comments (not all of which were unqualified support), 575 likes and 44 reshares.  Better, but still a really, really small sample size for a product that is intended to sell millions.        

 

As always, it's your company and your product, but doing things that divide your audience or declaring that some people aren't the right people for your product just seems like an unproductive approach.  Rather than spending time engaging in arguments and debates with people you don't agree with or attacking influencers or other companies that are well established in the marketplace, I would hope your focus would be on sharing information and making a great product.  I think it's perfectly acceptable for you to declare that we will just have to agree to disagree as you have done several times, but following that up with an argument or attack just seems to defeat the entire purpose of that phrase.     

every decision they make can “divide” the audience. 
 

- controllers don’t contain guts enough to be able to run the games on their own.  There goes the switch crowd

- the console won’t run Mario 64 type of 3D games, nor any other open world type of games. Well there goes that crowd

in this case, creating a founders edition is not splitting the crowd!! If people don’t like it, then just wait for the standard edition, you are literally waiting something like a few DAYS longer.  If these types of decision, which have nothing to do with the guts of the machine or it’s games make people hesitate to jump in, then people need to re-evaluate what they are looking for, because “fun gaming console” doesn’t appear to be the goal.  If one want to wait to see more hardware specs and more info on games, now THAT is cool... and totally irrelevant to this current drama because that info will come but not for a few months still (E3) so wait until then and either bail or jump In at that time

if I didn’t know better, and I surely do not, I would think the biggest issue is simply that people believe in an FE model but only if it’s a free pre-order.  So that way they don’t miss out on exclusivity and don’t feel left out of the entire process because the current process is not one they believe in

the only division here is born out of perception, not facts.  You quote stats you can see in support of representation but do not see all the info (private emails/private Facebook messages/people he talks to at his shows, investors, etc).  

5 minutes ago, Loafer said:

If one want to wait to see more hardware specs and more info on games, now THAT is cool... and totally irrelevant to this current drama because that info will come but not for a few months still (E3) so wait until then and either bail or jump In at that time

 

if I didn’t know better, and I surely do not, I would think the biggest issue is simply that people believe in an FE model but only if it’s a free pre-order.  So that way they don’t miss out on exclusivity and don’t feel left out of the entire process because the current process is not one they believe in

 

I think you are right. That is my issue exactly. I am just waiting to hear about finalized specs and games (the controller especially as it appears button placement, capacitive touchscreen, and inductive charging was changed recently). 

FYI: Tommy is speaking today at 1:30 at the CES 2020 [email protected] and Family Tech Summit today with Chris Down, Chief Design Officer Mattel and Zai Ortiz President & CEO Virsix Games & ALTA Games. The event is hosted by Valerie Vacante Founder & Managing Partner Collabsco & TechUp

Not sure if it is being live streamed so if anyone finds a link, post away.

1 hour ago, jaybird3rd said:

Define "nailed down."  The RetroVGS and "that Ataribox?" went to crowdfunding before any hardware design whatsoever had been done (as evidenced by the ludicrous John Carlsen "kitchen table lab" video); their approach was to get other peoples' money first, and then figure out what to design—and, in the case of "that Ataribox?", redesign multiple times—later.  Intellivision Entertainment has kept the Amico hardware specs close to the vest, and as I've said before, they've been wise to do so ... but that's hardly the same thing as claiming that the hardware isn't "nailed down."  They clearly have enough of a working prototype to begin building the games; to get to that point, the most important design decisions have already been locked in, and they're past the point where they should have to make any show-stopping changes.  There's no good reason they should have to wait for the final production hardware to offer a special edition as a preorder.

 

As for the price ... if you're not comfortable paying that much for a "Founder's Edition" preorder, there's no obligation to do so; it's clearly not for you, so just wait for the regular Amico to come out.  The difference between the Amico and "that Ataribox?" in this regard is that, if everyone holds on to their money until after it's released, "that Ataribox?" (and other similarly crowdfunded consoles) won't be released at all, while the Amico will be released regardless.

 

What do you mean by "one of the same things"?  Is it the idea of accepting money up front for something that hasn't been released yet?  Just about every preorder offered by everybody would fall into that category.

 

I'm not aware that anyone has ever said that "some people aren't the right people for your product"; they've said that the (totally optional) "Founder's Edition" isn't a product intended for every customer, which is very different.  I also wouldn't consider responding to unfair criticisms and inaccurate reporting as "attacking."  As for sharing information and listening to feedback, that's what this thread is supposed to be all about.  If there is any "division" in the audience, it's because some seem to persist in drawing analogies between things and situations which are almost completely different.

While I appreciate your points, other companies that have done similar "founders editions" have had retail pricing of their consoles locked down long before they took preorders.  Indeed, with Xbox One X, Microsoft opened preorders of the Scorpio Edition on August 17th with the console releasing in early November of the same year.  The final retail pricing was in place and the hardware was already in manufacturing.  Also, with most retailers like Best Buy and Amazon, no money was required to be put down for the preorder and you could cancel at anytime or return with normal return policies.  Gamestop required a $25 deposit in stores and nothing online.  Similarly, Google opened Stadia Founders Edition preorders in June 2019 with orders shipping in November 2019.  Again, while you had to enter a credit card, you weren't charged anything until shipping and you could cancel up to the ship date and they similarly had a return policy.

The reality is that for most tech items, money isn't collected by most retailers up front unless the buyer doesn't have a credit card.  I believe it's very likely that the Amico delivers, but like any business plan, things can fall apart or go terribly wrong.  Great intentions and even great leadership don't guarantee a certain outcome.

As for being not right for the product, Tommy has made this point repeatedly about how many in this thread are not the target for Amico.  Indeed, he has largely indicated that the target market is truly casual gamers who haven't owned consoles since the Wii or soccer moms or families or others and not classic gamers.  I just think it's foolish to disregard the audience that's most likely to buy something like this and instead focus on an audience that has largely showed little interest in what Amico intends to deliver.  Maybe there is some large untapped demand out there that hasn't been satisfied by the million other entertainment options that have emerged since the Wii was launched, but the people who seem most interested in Amico today in this thread and Twitter, Facebook and other forums do appear to be classic gamers or even current gamers and not this undefined mass of potential casual customers.    

9 minutes ago, GrudgeQ said:

FYI: Tommy is speaking today at 1:30 at the CES 2020 [email protected] and Family Tech Summit today with Chris Down, Chief Design Officer Mattel and Zai Ortiz President & CEO Virsix Games & ALTA Games. The event is hosted by Valerie Vacante Founder & Managing Partner Collabsco & TechUp

Not sure if it is being live streamed so if anyone finds a link, post away.

Intellivision  makes it up ces  but not atari. Atari still hanging in random hotel rooms " hey wanna come in and uh play with my joystick??"

1 hour ago, jaybird3rd said:

The bumbling company currently masquerading as Atari crowdfunded "that Ataribox?", thereby offloading all the risk onto their backers, because they did not—and, arguably, still do not—have the talent or resources to release it on their own.  Intellivision Entertainment is accepting preorders for a "Founder's Edition" Amico console, a project that they already initiated and secured funding for and were already on track to develop and release, without resorting to crowdfunding.  As far as I can tell, the only thing that the two have in common is the superficial resemblance of paying money up front to support a product that is not yet available, so to conflate them seems to me to be a serious stretch.

 

Having been here through the RetroVGS and Chameleon trainwrecks, and having followed the VCS since it was known as "that Ataribox?", I think I'm as alert as anyone to the dangers of "asking for money based on assured success and guaranteed refunds."  I don't see the Amico as belonging to the same category at all, and I'm surprised that so many people seem to be having so much trouble distinguishing the difference.

I don't disagree with you Jaybird, and I certainly hope Tommy's project is nothing like those other two. I haven't claimed that it is, and feel I've been clear that I'm looking for signs of credibility to this project because I'm interested in it, but weary of others that have been disappointing. Sitting through pages of aspersions cast at curly haired people who I don't know or care one whit about, or watching a professed industry leader slinging around gratuitous imagery to help bolster a family friendly brand indicates unprofessionalism in the extreme, and makes me question everything he says. I feel I've been more than restrained, then accused of some passive aggressive conspiracy toward the guy because, like a few others he likes to grouse about, I don't take everything he offers up as truth without evidence. His insistence on compliance with his point of view and tactics sure raises more red flags. It's an especially bad sign when the project lead snaps and unleashes some kind of amorphous conspiracy accusations, and effectively demands that nobody should dare question his truth.  

I'm not trying to come off as passive, I'm pretty darn direct. If questioning things offered up as truths with little evidence is considered aggressive, then guilty as charged. I think I've been more than fair about this project to date considering the mounting level of claims that have been made that have yet to pass the smell test. I don't think Tommy wants anybody to look too hard into the assortment of records and awards he offers up as proof of his personal credibility when their origins are easily researched. I'd love to see some leadership displayed through actions rather than expectations of respect and adoration to sooth somebody's narcissism. It's disturbing that Tommy seems to only have openness (and professionalism) to others who have love for Tommy in common with him. 

I have no desire to spar with Tommy or anybody, and I've been half tempted to just step away and drop any interest in this project. That would be ironic given the thread was supposed to engage with potential customers rather than alienate them. With what's coming to light though, there seems to be more here than meets the eye, and I'm even more interested to see where this is going. I'd love to see a little more civility and less, "passive aggressive" salesmanship and what appears at this point to be fundraising when that was specifically heralded as something he wouldn't, and didn't need to do.         

3 hours ago, Tommy Tallarico said:

And there ya go folks!  The truth is revealed.  Your passive aggressive diatribes have now been outed.  At least you finally admit what your real issue is.  Took ya long enough. 

You just can't stand the fact that this thread exists and (what most would call) my openness to speak with folks who have stuff in common with me.   I'll let you in on something... if you don't like the way I'm coming across and interacting... that's fine... but it isn't going to stop.  So you may want to do yourself a favor and save a lot of headaches and drama by just not coming here anymore.  See how simple that is?   

It wears thin on you??  Then please...  stop coming here.  No one is forcing you.  Please... stop commenting if you dislike it so much.  Maybe the way you've been interacting "wears thin" on the majority here. 

What a dumb post. You have no idea how ridiculous you sound or come across.  That's the sad part (but to me funny) .   

Hope you won't be posting here anymore... I wouldn't want your snowflake ass to melt.

1 minute ago, Nolagamer said:

Intellivision  makes it up ces  but not atari. Atari still hanging in random hotel rooms " hey wanna come in and uh play with my joystick??"

Honestly though, I am actually very happy for the *VCS backers* that Atari SA is finally showing some signs that they actually want to produce a console. They have just bungled the whole PR/updates/treating customers decently so badly many have written them off completely. I really hope the backers get what they want from the VCS so from that standpoint I am rooting for them.

8 minutes ago, JBerel said:

I have no desire to spar with Tommy or anybody, and I've been half tempted to just step away and drop any interest in this project.

 

Don't worry about leaving a bit! Tommy I hereby solemnly promise to buy two Amicos - one for me and one to make up for losing JBerel. You are off the hook JBerel, rest assured everything will be OK with you just assisting other projects.

Nah, nobody gets off that easy. Me and Tommy are mates. I'm loving this side of him, so we have that in common now.

And my hair's curly too. So there's that.

I for one like the idea of the founders edition mostly because of the gift certificate for the online store because I know I’m going to want to buy games for it and that will definitely aid in that.  I also don’t quite understand stand the view that making something special for the fans is a bad thing.  I would think that any tweaks to the system happening now is probably because of feedback from game developers or focus testing or testing internally.  
 

I am excited for a more wide audience product I think this will be something for anyone although this founders edition may not be for everyone and indeed no product will please everyone I think we as Intellivision and classic gaming fans

are definitely part of the target for this machine I am excited for a return to gaming after taking the last generation off 

11 minutes ago, JBerel said:

Nah, nobody gets off that easy. Me and Tommy are mates. I'm loving this side of him, so we have that in common now.

 

And my hair's curly too. So there's that.

Yep hanging around like herpes - good ol' JBerel

14 minutes ago, Alpha82 said:

I for one like the idea of the founders edition mostly because of the gift certificate for the online store because I know I’m going to want to buy games for it and that will definitely aid in that.  I also don’t quite understand stand the view that making something special for the fans is a bad thing.  I would think that any tweaks to the system happening now is probably because of feedback from game developers or focus testing or testing internally.  
 

I am excited for a more wide audience product I think this will be something for anyone although this founders edition may not be for everyone and indeed no product will please everyone I think we as Intellivision and classic gaming fans

are definitely part of the target for this machine I am excited for a return to gaming after taking the last generation off 

I never said there shouldn't be a Founder's Edition.  In fact, I don't recall anyone saying that.  My concerns are with the timing of preorders and the amount of money being collected up front.  

I guess Tommy shouldn’t really be surprised that he comes onto a mostly hardcore gamer website and after telling people for a year he is making a console and games that is/are not like the Big Three or for hard core gamers that people would still be harping away a year later about how he should be doing things more like the big three, be focused on hard core gamers and not those cell phone using casuals and make it portable like the switch rather than family focused. 

2 hours ago, bojay1997 said:

It's not about distinguishing the difference between Amico and two scammy projects, it's about the fact that Amico is now adopting one of the things the two scammy projects did after repeatedly saying Amico wouldn't go down that road.  

I guess Tesla is one big scamming car company then. 🙄